My Correspondence With a Monergist Theologian, His First Reply and My Rebuttal



  Well, the question was posed. I had kind of hoped for a short, direct answer; though his longer one did give me a chance to test-debate my case against someone who knew what he was talking about.

J.C.

Thanks for your email. You say you are leaning toward synergism. That is you believe regeneration (the new birth) is NOT the work of God alone but a cooperate work between man and God. That is, that the unregenerate person is morally able to see the truth, beauty and excellency of Jesus Christ. Even though the Scripture states that the natural man (the person without the Holy Spirit) is unable to understand spiritual truth, in fact he thinks it foolish (1 Cor 2:14).

Furthermore, the Bible plainly teaches divine monergism in salvation. John 6:63-65 for example says that no one can believe in Jesus UNLESS God grants it and verse 33 sasy that ALL to whom God grants will believe. That is a syllogism. A universal positive and a universal negative which does not leave room for human boasting. It is not the will of man or the will of the flesh, but God who has mercy (John 1:13, Rom 9:16).

Another passage is just as clear: 1 John speaks of the new birth in Christ the immediate cause of our love for Christ, our obedience and our faith in Him. The following passages in the Greek all show the past tense of the new birth causing the action....

"If you know that he is righteous, you may be sure that everyone who practices righteousness has been born of him." (1 John 2:29)

"No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God." (1 John 3:9)

Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God, and whoever loves has been born of God and knows God.

The above two passages show that our obedience and love of Christ springs from the fact that we HAVE BEEN born of God. An unregenerate person cannot, by definition, obey or love Christ. Love for Christ is not his heart's deepest animating principle and motive, nor is it his motive at all. Christ must stir up faith in us, grant us faith in the new birth as the following passage testifies:

"Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God..." (1 John 5:1)

As you can see, just like the other passages in 1 John which show that love of God and obedience spring from a renewed, quickened heart, so does faith. Those who believe do so because they HAVE BEEN born of God.

All the benefits of redemption such as conversion (faith & repentance), justification, sanctification and perseverance presuppose the existence of spiritual life found only in our union with Christ. The work of applying God's grace is a unitary process given to the elect simultaneously.

As for your other question, the Scripture indeed teaches that we MUST persevere to the end ... In this you and I fully agree (John 15:1-15). But that is only half the equation. It also clearly teaches that God will preserve us to the end (John 15:16). Please take the time to read the following short piece Can a Christian Lose His or Her Salvation? by Greg Johnson.

Also, I think it is VERY important to consider something in light of perseverance of the saints. If a person can actually lose their salvation, as you seem to be claiming ... it is tantamount to asserting that what Jesus did for us is NOT SUFFICIENT. If we begin by the Spirit but complete it by the flesh then we commit the galatian heresy. Consider, what you are believing is that YOU MUST MAINTAIN YOUR OWN JUSTIFICATION BEFORE GOD. That Jesus, when he prayed that God would preserve his own, failed. His prayer was ineffectual in John 17 for his people. Can the prayer of Jesus NOT be answered in the affirmative? Are you basing your justification on your sanctification?

Is not the idea that our good works contribute to the price of our redemption a Roman catholic error? Isn't that why we left the RCC at the Reformation because they believed that what Jesus did for us was not enough?

You see we all believe that God's people must persevere in obedience and faith to the end. The question is, does this spring from God's grace or is it a matter of the will. If you say "both" then I must ask you, why does one man persevere and not the other? What makes the two persons to differ? grace? No, not to you because both had grace. So it must have been something in the flesh that made one to differ. One either had more virtue, tenacity, moral fortitude etc. Your answer, in other words, is found outside of Jesus Christ. Christ either saves us completely or he does not save us at all. For if you were to trust in your own ability to persevere or continaully love God with all your heart, soul, mind and your neighbor as yourself, then none would have hope. We would all perish. What kind of a Gospel is that? it is not the gospel but the same heresy that Paul warned against in Galatians. "Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh?"

Either we are saved by grace alone in Christ alone, or the alternative is that we must pay PART OF the price of our redemption. Does Christ save us UNTO good works, or are we saved because we trust in good works?

It is very dangerous to believe that Christians can lose their salvation because this belief does not put Christ at the center of your faith. Is Christ sufficient to save you or not?

31But if we judged ourselves truly, we would not be judged. 32But when we are judged by the Lord, we are disciplined so that we may not be condemned along with the world. 1 Corinthians 11:31-33 (English Standard Version)

Grace and peace


I could see where this was going. Few Calvinists/eternal securists I have ever spoken to have ever wanted to address the passages that disagree with their doctrine directly. They try to shoot holes in other points your case instead to get the intellectual high ground, I knew I would have to deal with his counter first before I reiterated my question.

Dear ______,

Thank you for your response. I have addressed your questions, etc. below to clarify my beliefs.

"...you believe regeneration (the new birth) is NOT the work of God alone but a cooperate work between man and God. That is, that the unregenerate person is morally able to see the truth, beauty and excellency of Jesus Christ. Even though the Scripture states that the natural man (the person without the Holy Spirit) is unable to understand spiritual truth, in fact he thinks it foolish (1 Cor 2:14)."

I believe that unregenerate man is unable to accept the things of God apart from God's grace; and that God must open a person's heart to receive the truth of the gospel. Natural man cannot do such a thing from his innate ability without the work of God.


"Furthermore, the Bible plainly teaches divine monergism in salvation. John 6:63-65 for example says that no one can believe in Jesus UNLESS God grants it and verse 33 sasy that ALL to whom God grants will believe. That is a syllogism. A universal positive and a universal negative which does not leave room for human boasting. It is not the will of man or the will of the flesh, but God who has mercy (John 1:13, Rom 9:16)."

Election is according to both the divine purpose and the foreknowledge of God. It is not of us because we do not deserve it in any sense, but this does not negate election based on foreknowledge.


"Another passage is just as clear: 1 John speaks of the new birth in Christ the immediate cause of our love for Christ, our obedience and our faith in Him. The following passages in the Greek all show the past tense of the new birth causing the action....

"If you know that he is righteous, you may be sure that everyone who practices righteousness has been born of him." (1 John 2:29)

"No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for God's seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God." (1 John 3:9)

"Beloved, let us love one another, for love is from God, and whoever loves has been born of God and knows God.

The above two passages show that our obedience and love of Christ springs from the fact that we HAVE BEEN born of God. An unregenerate person cannot, by definition, obey or love Christ. Love for Christ is not his heart's deepest animating principle and motive, nor is it his motive at all. Christ must stir up faith in us, grant us faith in the new birth as the following passage testifies:

"Everyone who believes that Jesus is the Christ has been born of God..." (1 John 5:1)

As you can see, just like the other passages in 1 John which show that love of God and obedience spring from a renewed, quickened heart, so does faith. Those who believe do so because they HAVE BEEN born of God.

All the benefits of redemption such as conversion (faith & repentance), justification, sanctification and perseverance presuppose the existence of spiritual life found only in our union with Christ. The work of applying God's grace is a unitary process given to the elect simultaneously."

Being born of God is synonymous with being saved, it does not precede faith and love, but is concurrent with them. The Bible makes it very clear that spiritual life comes with hearing and believing in Christ, not before.

"Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live." John 5:25

"But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name." John 20:31

Galatians 4:7 says,

"Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ."

We are both sons of God, and thereby heirs through Christ, not in Christ because we are sons.


"As for your other question, the Scripture indeed teaches that we MUST persevere to the end ... In this you and I fully agree (John 15:1-15). But that is only half the equation. It also clearly teaches that God will preserve us to the end (John 15:16). Please take the time to read the following short piece Can a Christian Lose His or Her Salvation? by Greg Johnson."

While it does teach that God will preserve us, it also gives warnings and admonishments to believers about the possibility of falling away. While it is by God's grace we then stand, the word also indicates that we must not frustrate it. Thus I adopt a position similar to that of the Council of Orange on this issue:

"...all baptized persons have the ability and responsibility, if they desire to labor faithfully, to perform with the aid and cooperation of Christ what is of essential importance in regard to the salvation of their soul."

as well as what Peter wrote,

"Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure [stable, fast, firm, unshaken, constant]: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall" 2 Peter 1:10

This is of course not done by force of human will, but with the aid of the Holy Spirit that dwells within us, also known as Synergism.


"Also, I think it is VERY important to consider something in light of perseverance of the saints. If a person can actually lose their salvation, as you seem to be claiming ... it is tantamount to asserting that what Jesus did for us is NOT SUFFICIENT."

If you are referring to the power of the atonement, even most Calvinists will acknowledge that if not for God's preservation, a saint could fall from God's grace and be lost; perseverance (Synergistic or Monergistic) is a necessity, thus rendering that argument moot.


"If we begin by the Spirit but complete it by the flesh then we commit the galatian heresy. Consider, what you are believing is that YOU MUST MAINTAIN YOUR OWN JUSTIFICATION BEFORE GOD."

Not in the flesh, for if I believed I could maintain my justification before God in the power of my flesh then I would be a Monergist...the other kind. By definition, Synergism means that it is with the power of God in us. With men it is impossible, but With God, all things are possible (Matthew 19:26).


"That Jesus, when he prayed that God would preserve his own, failed. His prayer was ineffectual in John 17 for his people. Can the prayer of Jesus NOT be answered in the affirmative? Are you basing your justification on your sanctification?"


No, it did not fail, for God works within us to preserve us just as Christ prayed; this is not preclude the possibility of anyone falling away. Justification is based on faith in Christ. If one does not hold to the faith, then he is no longer justified. That people can and have fallen away is clearly stated in scripture,

"Holding faith, and a good conscience; which some having put away concerning faith have made shipwreck: Of whom is Hymenaeus and Alexander; whom I have delivered unto Satan, that they may learn not to blaspheme." 1 Timothy 1:19-20

The example you cited from Galatians is another good example of men falling from God's grace, being estranged from Christ, and to whom Christ had become of no effect to. The scripture clearly indicates that they had been known of God (Galatians 4:9), yet had fallen from His grace, which can hardly be called persevering; God did not fail to keep them, they wilfully strayed from Him by trusting in the works of the law. Note that my believing that one must continue to trust in Christ is not trust in trust, for my trust cannot save me in and of itself. It is only by God's mercy that I am saved, which He has conditioned on trusting in His Son, and for which he has provided divine power and grace (not an irresistible unction) to His elect.


"Is not the idea that our good works contribute to the price of our redemption a Roman catholic error? Isn't that why we left the RCC at the Reformation because they believed that what Jesus did for us was not enough?"

I'm non-denominational. Not Protestant, Anglican, Catholic, Orthodox, Coptic, or Mennonite: Just Christian. But fulfilling the condition of continuing in the faith by the power of the Holy Spirit can hardly be called salvation by works, as faith and works of the law are diametrically opposed.


"You see we all believe that God's people must persevere in obedience and faith to the end. The question is, does this spring from God's grace or is it a matter of the will."

Both. I might qualify that with 'regenerate will empowered by God's grace.'


"If you say "both" then I must ask you, why does one man persevere and not the other?"

Because one abides in Christ, the other does not.

(That was easy)




"What makes the two persons to differ? grace? No, not to you because both had grace. So it must have been something in the flesh that made one to differ."

Grace does make us differ from the world, for only by God's grace can we have any choice to do what is right. But freedom of the will (for whom the Son sets free is free indeed - John 8:36) also implies freedom to do wickedly as well. If it is under God's grace, then it by definition cannot be in the flesh.


"One either had more virtue, tenacity, moral fortitude etc. Your answer, in other words, is found outside of Jesus Christ."

Incorrect, for only in following Christ can one persevere, and even then it is only by the power to persevere that God gives. The difference is that I believe that God permits His grace to be resisted.


"Christ either saves us completely or he does not save us at all."

Slippery slope with errant conclusion; being saved does not preclude the possibility of apostasy.


"For if you were to trust in your own ability to persevere or continaully love God with all your, heart, soul, mind and your neighbor as yourself, then none would have hope. We would all perish. What kind of a Gospel is that? it is not the gospel but the same heresy that Paul warned against in Galatians. "Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh?"

Which is exactly why grace precedes any spiritual ability. Even full Arminians acknowledge this.


"Either we are saved by grace alone in Christ alone, or the alternative is that we must pay PART OF the price of our redemption."

Fulfilling a condition (especially when it is God who grants one the ability to do so) is not indicative of paying part of the price.


"Does Christ save us UNTO good works, or are we saved because we trust in good works?"

We are saved by trusting in Christ. Good works follow as a result. Trying to equate what we do by the grace of God with keeping works of the law is errant, as the two stand in stark contrast.


"It is very dangerous to believe that Christians can lose their salvation because this belief does not put Christ at the center of your faith."

If perseverance is centered around abiding in Christ, then that statement is a non-sequitur.

(I thought that would have been kind of obvious)


"Is Christ sufficient to save you or not?"

Yes, but He tells me to abide in Him or be cast out. Abiding and even believing does not pay the price for salvation, but it is what God requires of us.


"The main issue is the fact that God gives many commands in Scripture, all of which we have the inability to carry out apart from Christ. But Christ does for us what we cannot do for ourselves. The purpose of the law is not to show our ability but our inability (Rom 3:19, 20) Which makes us flee to Christ. So when God commands us to persevere to the end, He is not telling us to look to our own resources to get there, but rather that we look to Christ, who alone is sufficient to fully save."

Note: He did shoot me a smaller email that contained pretty much just the above paragraph. In all fairness, he did sort of indirectly reference my question from Revelation, but failed to hit the heart of the matter

I agree that it is impossible to carry out such commands apart from Christ, this does not negate Synergism in the least: It would not be Synergism if we could do it ourselves.

(I think that's only logical; the last objection reduced to rubble, I continued to press the original point)

But the fact remains that we have a clear warning with a consequence that logically cannot fit with the Monergistic scheme of salvation: The possibility that a believer can forfeit his or her share in the kingdom of God. If Synergism is indeed a deep theological error, then why is not only the warning, but a consequence utterly incompatible with Monergism stated if the logical implication of said consequence is not to be believed?


In Christ,
[J.C.] Thibodaux


I think it necessary to underscore several points as to what I wrote:


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